Arlene Foreman, M.S. has an extraordinary ability to quickly get to the heart of an issue. She attributes her success to devoting positive energy to all areas of her life. “I am continually challenging myself to grow. I believe successful therapists must have a profound understanding of themselves. This knowledge enables them to inspire others to become more than they ever imagined they could be.”

From her busy Ardmore office, Arlene Foreman has developed her own unique form of psychotherapy with communication skills as her primary focus. She is on the cutting edge — helping people to release communication blocks so that their real selves can emerge.

Arlene’s clients come from a diverse range of cultures. “I strive to respect people’s unique values and culture and consider these when I am helping clients to resolve issues.”

“People often come to their first session fearful of being misunderstood and blamed. Instead, they leave with clarity, safety, and exciting new skills.” Drawing on twenty-eight years of experience, Arlene Foreman is a Licensed Professional Counselor. She helps couples not only resolve their conflicts but to create super marriages.

Professional memberships include The American Mental Health Counselors Association, The Center for Frontier Sciences, The Anxiety Disorders Association of America, and The Group Counseling Association.

Steve Martorano 
The Behavioral Corner is produced in partnership with Retreat Behavioral Health -- where healing happens.

The Behavioral Corner 
Hi, and welcome. I'm Steve Martorano. And this is the Behavioral Corner; you're invited to hang with us, as we've discussed the ways we live today, the choices we make, the things we do, and how they affect our health and wellbeing. So you're on the corner, the Behavioral Corner, please hang around a while.

Steve Martorano 
Hi, everybody, welcome to the Behavioral Corner. It's me again, Steve Martorano -- holding court here, on the intersection of everything and everything else. The Behavioral Corner, what we do is...we talk about those decisions, those events in our lives, the choices we make, and how all of that conspires to give us the life we have and the way we feel about it -- emotionally, psychologically, spiritually. It's a podcast, as I tell everybody, that is, with all modesty, about everything, because that's pretty much what affects us. It's all underwritten by our great partners in this endeavor, Retreat, Behavioral Health, about which war a little bit later. Well, you know, let's...let's jump right into this, because we are not so far removed from the "slap heard round the world," which, when...when Will Smith hit Chris Rock, he graphically illustrated, I think the zeitgeist of a lot of people who are angry. We seem to be in some kind of golden age of anger, which is probably not unusual. Anger is an emotion. What seems to be peaking though is people's inability to, not control it, but to channel it to make sure it doesn't result in dangerous and destructive behavior. Because you can be upset at something someone said about your wife, really upset about it, but what you really can't do is walk up and smack somebody in the face. So we're talking about that. We're talking about anger, and how to manage it. So what do you do? You go get somebody who is here on the corner with us, who has over three decades now of experience in this field. Arlene Foreman is our guest on the Behavioral Corner. Arlene is a Certified Anger Management Specialist, and we welcome her to the program. Hi, Arlene.

Arlene Foreman 
Nice to be here. I thank you for inviting me.

Steve Martorano 
Oh, it's our pleasure to have you. And I know...you should be very busy, so I won't keep you for very long. So let me ask you about that my premise that this is some kind of golden age of anger. I know everybody says that the age we live in is the craziest of all. What have you seen the...over your experience with regard to the prevalence of anger, and people's and it's destructive...as a destructive force? Have you over 30 years of experience have you seen it get worse?

Arlene Foreman 
That's a good question. I don't see it getting worse in the session, because that's who comes here, 30 years, people who have issues with anger come. So I...if I were going to look at a broad view of all the people, then it would only be my feeling when out on the Blue Route and I watch how people drive.

Steve Martorano 
Look, we're all the same. We all exist in the same sort of space. So yeah, you're on the Blue Route. I don't suspect you've ever been involved in a road rage incident. But now you see more of a...road rage was not a phenomenon 30 years ago, not the way it is today. People are on a hair-trigger. And I just wondered whether you see that in your office. You're right though...the people that are coming to you have already recognized they have a problem, or someone told them they had a problem. And they're there for help. So let me ask you about them. You know, who are they? And how do they get to you? Under what circumstances are they there? Is it because someone told them they had to go?

Arlene Foreman 
The two biggest reasons: Their wives make them come or they're leaving, or their boss, makes some come or they're fired. Once in a while, I get somebody who says I'm sick and tired of my behavior helps me. Once in a while. But mostly that's who comes.

Steve Martorano 
You know, why do you suppose that it's so hard for people to recog...it sounds like it's harder for people to recognize that they have anger issues then, you know, maybe some other mood disorder. You say they're usually under duress. Someone said get in there and get help. And fewer times do they say I'm tired of this? Why do you think that is?

Arlene Foreman 
You know, when I tell my clients like we didn't get a rearview mirror. We don't get to see ourselves. Part of the way I work with anger is to get out here and have a watcher and take a look at your behavior. Without a watcher, we don't know. We can see how we behave. If I'm behaving in an angry way, it's because I feel it's the right thing to do.

Steve Martorano 
That's...that's what I was just about to say. The reason people probably lack self-awareness of their issue with anger is that generally, you think you're right. 

Arlene Foreman 
Right. And people mostly, some...are not self-aware. It's the most important work I do is teaching people to step outside themselves and watch.

Steve Martorano 
And again, it's the...it's the issue of anger, which after all, is just, in one sense, a garden variety, emotion. 

Arlene Foreman 
Right.

Steve Martorano 
I mean, we...we are happy, we are sad. We are melancholy. There a number of ways to feel. Anger is the issue, though, that if there is an abundance of it, you have a problem. I mean, no one goes to see a therapist because they're too happy, right?

Arlene Foreman 
No, we can have an abundance of anger. It's not about anger. It's about behavior. I can be really angry at you. That doesn't give me the right to sit here and swear at you and call you names and make you feel that. That's the problem, not the feeling.

Steve Martorano 
So is it typical for you, I guess there is no typical session for you. But I guess the last thing you would say to a client or a patient is, "Oh, you shouldn't be angry." Or, "You shouldn't feel that way."

Arlene Foreman 
Anger is built into our nervous system. You can't be angry. But you can decide how you want to act on it. It's all about the behavior.

Steve Martorano 
When you say we're hardwired, that makes anger, a kind of defense mechanism. It's a way we were able to survive. There are things that are supposed to make you angry, correct?

Arlene Foreman 
Well, back here is the amygdala. An organ inside the brain that's there for one reason: survival. And anger is an aggressive feeling to attack for survival. A million, 2 million, 5 million years ago in the savanna, we're animals, we're mammals, whether we like it or not. And when we're threatened, the amygdala says, go 'em. You know, I'm an animal, but I have a prefrontal cortex that says, "Wait a minute, amygdala, chill out, you're not gonna die."

Steve Martorano 
Arlene Foreman is our guest, she is a certified anger management therapist. And that's why we're here together for you to shed some light on that moment, between the back of your brain, the front of your brain, which most of us are able to navigate. We're able to make that pause. But many, many others just are not. Take us through some of the established techniques you've had success with, in getting that pause to work.

Arlene Foreman 
There is a relatively new kind of therapy. And that's called A.C.T. Acceptance Commitment Therapy. And the whole premise of A.C.T. is I step outside myself -- I call it my watcher -- I step outside my watch so and I watch my feelings, let's say anger, I watch the anger. I go inside what's going on in my body, tightness in my chest. My throat is starting to hurt. I see my face tightening up. I'm watching all of that. And I have -- and this is an important word -- a willingness to sit in it. I can generate anger feelings if I want to. My body does it. My nervous system does it. And I watch enough I sit and I'm quiet. And I watch that body. That nervous system quiets down. The very act of polling outside of myself calms down the nervous system.

Steve Martorano 
How do you help people get to that moment of reflection when you...when you as you say you're out here observing rather than reacting? Does it seem to me in my experience, the anger button, or the anger trigger? Is hair...it's a hair-trigger. There's not much reflection when the guy cuts you off on the highway and your anger. How do you slow the process is down

Arlene Foreman 
With rehearsal. You know, the Soviets, like in the 1960s, they figured out that if you're rehearsing, shooting a ball into the basket, but there's no ball and there is no basket, the brain still makes changes just from imagining. And I think they took away some gold medals from that. And they taught us all about the power of rehearsal through imagination. So if I have an issue with anger, every time I see you, it really makes me mad. And I sit quietly. And I bring you into my awareness. And I allow myself to get angry. And I get my watcher out. And I sit with it. And when I feel like I'm quiet, we call it diffused. When I'm quiet enough, I asked myself, what's really important, what...what's really important is I want Steve to hang out with me. So then I start acting that way. One time during rehearsal, not going to do it. You know, it takes around 21 days to make it shift. But I think it's like around 60 days. You got it. It's in your brain.

Steve Martorano 
I wonder if you agree that if we could see ourselves on tape...videotape authentically being angry, that would have a shocking effect on us?

Arlene Foreman 
Right? Well, that's what the watcher is about. That's exactly right. I don't know. I don't know. Because I don't have a rearview mirror.

Steve Martorano 
Arlene is part of the problem with getting a handle on this is that we the laypeople and I guess maybe some less gifted therapists have the, you know, the cart before the horse. We keep talking about anger, anger, anger, and miss what we're really talking about is how do you act when you're mad? 

Arlene Foreman 
That's everything!

Steve Martorano 
Right. That's the key. How do you behave?

Arlene Foreman 
The only problem with anger is I shoot myself in the foot. I can sit quietly, steaming it, you and I act appropriately, and set myself up for heart disease. So it's not really healthy if I'm doing it a lot. 

Steve Martorano 
Yeah. 

Arlene Foreman 
But other than that, that's why the therapy is called A.C.T. Everything is about how I decide to act.

Steve Martorano 
Well, you mentioned relaxation. You've also mentioned managing the actual physical reaction to being angry -- managing it to slow your breath down. Notice your eyes are bulging. You're beginning to perspire. Get a handle on that. Or does this happen at some other point? I know you're, you're talking about identifying the root of the anger. In other words, you may think it's the guy that cuts you off, that has caused this reaction. Maybe there's something else? Is that what you mean by identifying the root?

Arlene Foreman 
It's good to know the root, but vital to decide how to act. So if you have a limited amount of time to focus, focus on the behavior. If you've got enough time to explore where this is coming from, you know. I read with Will that he grew up... Did you hear that story? He grew up in a home where his father was abusing his mother and he stood by and watched helplessly. He couldn't protect his mother. Well, guess what? There was on stage played out.

Steve Martorano 
It's amazing. He chose the single worst moment to deal with that trauma. It's an amazing moment,

Arlene Foreman 
My guess is his amygdala fired off and the prefrontal cortex couldn't stop it.

Steve Martorano 
You know, people who are already complaining, you're making too much of this, and we're talking...I don't think we've made enough of it. I think we, I think it was so spectacularly inappropriate. It was so completely out of character. So unnecessary. That, given the age we're in, it's time to look at what happened there. Because something else...else you just said about this, looking for the root. There are instances you're right, where things are happening so quickly. Your first concern is your behavior. And if you have the luxury of time, you'll look at the root causes. I mean, politics works like that there is a former president, who shall go nameless, who arouses tremendous anger from his detractors. That's a situation where it would be probably more helpful not to say I shouldn't be angry at him, but to find out what it is it's bothering me. Is that what you're saying?

Arlene Foreman 
At the moment, no. I'm gonna say over and over at the moment, it doesn't matter what's bothering me, it doesn't matter what you're doing, I have to act on my own value. That's everything. You know, one of the damaging things that Will did is I'm going to go back into the body. There's something called the polyvagal nervous system hardwired in us, and it needs to feel safe. The hall with the Academy Awards was in and the people that were there all made a contract: If you come here, you'll be safe. So that nervous system could take a backseat and say, "Well, then I don't have to get the amygdala watching all the time. We're safe here." And then Will said, "No, you're not."

Steve Martorano 
What happens when the angry person feels that their anger is a result of an existential threat. In other words, the anger feels like it did 1000s and 1000s of years ago. The threat is existential. It could destroy me. Are they justified, then in using violence?

Arlene Foreman 
I'm gonna get my watcher out. And my watcher is going to look and say, is that just a thought? Or is there somebody with a gun pointed at my head? Or is it a play toy? What I've got to watch is what kind of thoughts is my brain generating from the amygdala that has nothing to do with what's real. And that's what I've got the watcher for. This is really dangerous. And I have to do something, and maybe I have to go after your throat if I think I'm gonna die. But you know what animals do in that place? They don't go after the throat. They run. They'll attack if they're cornered. But if they have a choice, they run.

Steve Martorano 
Were you...I don't mention this in any political sense whatsoever, only in the context of what you do for a living. Were you shocked at what happened on January 6, in the United States Capitol? There were a lot of people that we were angry with.

Arlene Foreman 
I was mortified. Absolutely mortified.

Steve Martorano 
You saw all of the negative consequences of not being able to handle anger played out large, right.

Arlene Foreman 
Right. Or I don't know if they even want to...I wonder if they use anger to justify their behavior to take them there. There are people that are addicted to anger. It's like a trip for them.

Steve Martorano 
Yes, yeah. There are people who relish confrontation. Think they thrive in that context and others who just shy away from that kind of thing. Anger is a lot of different things. I know that one of the topics you spent some time talking about -- I think it was you anyway -- but I'm sure you can. You know, there's justifiable anger, there's garden variety, anger, and then there's toxic anger.

Arlene Foreman 
No, there's just anger.

Steve Martorano 
Okay.

Arlene Foreman 
It's toxic when the behavior violates my own values. It's toxic.

Steve Martorano 
What happens when one's values are in line with their anger?

Arlene Foreman 
I saw it once. I had a client come in, and the conflict they had with his wife is he wanted to teach his son retribution on the playground, that if somebody hits you, you hit them back. And he wanted me to support him. And I said I don't support retribution. Go find a therapist that will help you get better retribution with your kids. Goodbye.

Steve Martorano 
That's good advice. A couple of other things about techniques. You talk about compassion a lot and empathy. Empathy in particular seems to be in short supply. How do you advise people to build an empathetic attitude?

Arlene Foreman 
Here's what I tell them. Forget the empathy, the compassion for the other person. For me, if I have empathy and compassion for you, I see crepe love hormones. It heals me. It's nice if you get a benefit too but it heals me. So that's the main reason that I tell people the healthiest thing you can do for yourself is compassion for yourself and compassion for other people because anger pumps adrenaline and cortisol. They're killer hormones in excess. Oxytocin is a low hormone. Well, if we get to pick, why not act with a low hormone?

Steve Martorano 
It makes a lot of sense to me. Arlene Foreman, let me ask you a couple of other things that might make your job more difficult. We...we live in a culture now where they have made a commodity of practically everything. And certainly anger...anger is a commodity. There is an anger industry in this country. On the one hand, well, there's always been anger and always will be. I don't know that it has been industrialized to the extent that has. Does that make your job more difficult?

Arlene Foreman 
No. And the reason it doesn't is that I have a way that has been researched for 20 years that works. So if anybody is saying that, you know, I want to clean up the way I behave with my anger, I say, I'm glad to help you.

Steve Martorano 
You advise people, though, that...that with regard to some of the activities that they're engaged in -- some of the programs they watch -- the books they read, the people they pay attention to, are exploiting their anger?

Arlene Foreman 
Absolutely. Right. They're using them because people get an adrenaline rush from it. And see, we get back to hormones. You know, the body likes a good shot of adrenaline, even if it'll kill you.

Steve Martorano 
You know, finally, this is just a question that I think my wife wanted me to ask you so I will. Does venting help?

Arlene Foreman 
Makes it worse.

Steve Martorano 
I said when she asked...she said, "Ask your venting helps." And I went, "You know, if venting doesn't help, my head's going to explode." I always thought that you get it off your chest, you blow up, and then...

Arlene Foreman 
No, you...the way you do it is you get your watcher out. There's a kind of breathing called Sky Breathing, where you breathe four in, four pause, eight out. You do that for a minute or two, and the anger dissipates. But for you to stand in front of your wife and scream and yell at her because you're venting your anger and it makes you feel good. It does. And now poor woman now needs a Xanax.

Steve Martorano 
I was using us as a hypothetical. 

Arlene Foreman 
I know. I know.

Steve Martorano 
Arlene, I could talk about this a lot. We're delighted that you joined us. You're not going to run out of clients anytime soon. So we hope we can call upon you in the future. We will be delighted to put your phone number you do all of your work now virtually, right? 

Arlene Foreman 
Right. Exactly. 

Steve Martorano 
So wherever you're hearing this or watching this podcast, if you want more information you can contact Arlene, we will have contact numbers for you. So you can reach her. Arlene. Thanks again.

Arlene Foreman 
My joy. You're welcome.

Steve Martorano 
Everybody. Take care. 

Arlene Foreman 
It was fun being here. I enjoyed doing it with you.

Steve Martorano 
Oh, great. Well, we'll do it again real soon. See you guys next time on the corner. Take care bye-bye.

Synergy Health Programs 
Millions of Americans are negatively affected daily by their mental health. Retreat has served the community for over ten years, offering comprehensive mental health programming through our mental health division, Synergy Health Programs. To learn more about Synergy, please reach out today at 855-802-6600.

The Behavioral Corner 
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